A pea gravel patio can be surprisingly difficult to keep maintained and repaired. Well, i figured pavers are just big stones, and it works for them. Thx, I do phone/email consultations for $93 an hour. Theres other ways to deal with weeds, but this article is getting long. I have thought of using the polymeric sand to keep out both as much as possible. As a professional contractor, I generally just purchase road base, gravel, and compact it for my foundation. Results may varypolymeric sand is not always easy to fix.. Lay the 2x down on top of the trench and hammer down to tamp. Quickrete mason mix type s. Green bag. Most polymeric sand manufacturers offer at least two colors that match 95% of the interlocking pavers on the marketplace today: tan and grey. Ive seen stone dust joint stabilizers are being sold, but that might be as bad as poly sand. Garden center. He wants to lay a new flagstone patio on top of a mix of sand mixed with cement(about 6 to 1). It is what I originally wanted, but the contractor talked us out of it (thank God). I used the granite sand as my leveling layer, too. We bought pea gravel at a local landscape supply company in some 5 gallon buckets for a couple of dollars each. Often, gator dust is used by contractors who set the stones 3 or 4 inches apart, and that usually causes problems. Sweeping dg into the joints again, because some voids will have appeared after the first hose down, then hosing down again. Though it may require some maintenance, down the road. After completing the digging of holes for the plants that I added, I topped the beds off with mulch and bark chips. No freeze-thaw issues. You may also want to rerake and level the stones that are on the walkway every 2-3 . If you used screenings as both the leveling agent and as the joint filler, this is no big deal. You can see the low spots where the water pools. I cant find any advice on-line about how to apply the stone dust. Natural flagstone, concrete paver and ceramic brick patios and walkways are set upon gravel foundations, their joints then need to be filled. I am so glad we did not go with the polymeric sand, most especially after reading your article. So first we plan to dig out and level the area, then lay down some coarse sand (tamp it) for drainage. I think Ill try the screening stuff. Dont use any real small stones. If the foundation is dry laid, repair using dry laid methods/if the foundation is cement based, repair with cementious materials. consider setting up a phone/email consultation with a professional stone hardscape instructor. Joints are all tight at and average of about 1/2 to 3/4 inch in width. I did find limestone screenings on this website: http://www.greenbuilderssupply.net/pr_bulk_materials_dumping.htm. The 2nd link has what theyre calling decomposed granite, but given my calling around locally, I question if thats the same stuff as what you specify. You cant really hide the edge thoughso dont bother trying to hide it, but go with an edge that you like the look of. I was looking for an explanation of red dust. First of all know that at this point, any means to clean off the stones will likely destroy the joints that youve installed. Id really have to see what you are working with, what the flagstone looks likeand then it would be a matter of looking into what is available in your area. I wish everyone would do that. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. 2023 The Taunton Press, Inc. All rights reserved. 2) level out the stones, one at a time, using the crushed stone to raise them up, as needed. Or can I fill all of the stones with top soil? If the pea gravel is used on a walkway or driveway, it can be enough to merely compress it to create stability. Or can you use stone dust to fix areas? Are there certain colors light or dark? Spread sand over the surface of the concrete and pea gravel. Maybe lay 2 inches and tamp that, lay the top layer and leave that loose. Placing a border around the perimeter of pea gravel paths and walkways is one of the best ways to stabilize pea gravel. Is that just the nature of stone dust? I used stone dust under as a base and then screened gravel (sand). does polymeric come in colors? Theres household cleaners out there, they sell them at the big box stores, probably grocery stores too maybe idk, but its a citrus extract and you have to be careful when cleaning with it because it dissolves some types of plastic. Devin, thank you for the article and for your generosity in responding to questions/comments. Ahoy, but I do see one application for this gravel glue messas a back-top alternative. The thing is.I dont think sealing the joints would really help much. Here is a link that might be useful: Klingstone Paths. My contractor is out of business so I cant even get hold of him. To first install the pea gravel, mark the area where the gravel will go and work the soil to a depth of approximately 5 to 6 inches. We have large four inch thick, Colonial stone laid on a dry base, like a stepping stone path. We probably have a dozen small ant hills to show as proof- lol. But I couldn't find it in Utah, and I also read that it sticks to your shoes and becomes a sanding agent if you have wood floors, which I do. Heres an article about removing and replacing the stone dust in-between your flagstone. Please advise what to do. Others seem to crack every 4-5 years (near roof leader downspouts and a few other areas that take longer to dry out due to adjoining vegetation). I recommend screeningswhich are 1/8 inch and smallerand contain the very important finesflour-like, powdery stone dust. Do you seal your stones after adding the screening? Get complete site access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code Check, and more, plus the print magazine. I think your solution is the answer. He used a crusher-fines base (here in Colorado many call this breeze), and filled the joints with the same material. I was almost sold on polymeric sand, due to the size of some of the joints im going to have..but read your blog. As mentioned in the article right above..I go with screenings. I have a dry laid flagstone patio in the backyard, and am exploring some joint filler options. One of the beautiful things about dry laid patios is that the foundation can withstand freeze and thaw without cracking like concrete will. I do know it's pretty spendy. How old is your patio? Thanks. We have to install the permeable pavers because it was required by the city. If stone chips are getting all over the surface of your flagstone, then the joints are probably over filled. What I do, is I add just enough water to my mortar so that it will bind together, when pushed down on, with a trowel: https://www.devineescapes.com/flagstone-walkway-re-pointing-repair-paoli/. I think I read up above that one shouldnt have to pressure wash flagstone patios very often I think you mentioned once every 10 years. Great advice and beautiful work around the pool.. thank you! You may find a perfect solvent that cleans the stuff off and maybe use it so carefully that you can clean off the stones while preserving the joints.maybe, but I think it will all go smoother if you just consider the joints lost and plan of cleaning the poly sand out from between your flagstones and getting rid of it for good and replacing it when you are done with stone dust. Theres also an adjoining bluestone path with 2 joints, but Ive used mulch for those and pounded it in; seems to be holding although it gets weedy of course. Then tamp. Thanks in advance for your comments. The rest are med to med-small with a few fillers. You could a) hire a professional. Love your artwork with stone. I plan to do a flagstone patio. An inch of slope per four feet is right, water should flow. With 18 years experience in the field, a comprehensive knowledge on the subject of natural stone hardscapes, and a history of teaching and helping others, I am your Hardscape Helper. Common does not mean good. Its 3/8 in size, and says with finesthats what you need. As such, I wouldnt really consider a dry lay option on top of old concrete unless the customer very much wanted it, and unless the flagstone itself were going to have a really tight fitting joints for example if it was going to be a pattern cut, square and rectangular flagstones with minimal joints then, if the walkway is pitched strong enough there really is not much way for a very much in order to get down there in the first place. Thanks. Best way that Ive found to remove that sort of haze is to just use a power washer. Perhaps with the larger particles that wont be an issue? We didn't try to stabilize it, but what we did do is to put down flagstones in the pathways. Private commission. Devin, What a great article. To be fair Ive seen exceptions! Im in Tucson AZ and have a very large flagstone patio that is 15 yrs old and is showing many cracks in the mortar grout. I noticed almost the same effect/thing on the dirt in the garden. I hope not. They say I mixed the cement wr. and our If you do not have any orange based cleaner, then try using a bit of vinegar along with the wire-brush. It seemed to work pretty well. Your sculptures are amazing by the way! Make your joints tighter. Im not a big fan of sealing flagstone or color enhancers. When using a hand tamper on decomposed granite, it will stick to the bottom of the hand tamper in clumps. Most areas are failing, so I plan on filling the gaps with stone dust. We bought an older house last year, and what I thought was a small stone landing at the base of the old deck turned out to be an irregular limestone patio. Use too much water and the binder, an acrylic glue, washes out and leaves a nasty haze all over your carefully laid flagstone. Removing the grout is going to be a horrendous job. On the note of odor, there are products you can hook up to your hose pipe to breakdown dog waste and odors. One of those might be ochre stone. Thank you for your devotion to this subject. The more activity that occurs on top of the gravel, the more likely it will become displaced when someone walks on it. that is the stone dust that you refer to, pea gravel or something else as a filler in cracks that wide? Ive never known a patio to be be pressure washed more often then maybe once a decade or soMost home owners never once pressure wash their flagstones, so it is usually a non-issue. 2 or 3? Haven't had a chance to try yet. Theres some things I dont know here.how long ago were the mortar joints done? Im so glad I found your webpage. Sorry, I was out of town and away from my computer when you posted this question. This article might help a bit too: https://www.devineescapes.com/taking-care-of-your-patio/%. Place the pea gravel on top of the concrete mix and level it out with the trowel. So glad I found your blog, almost as much as finding a buried 1220 flagstone patio in our backyard! Sure, but not forever. I wound up reading your blog post on using poly in flagstone joints. If the tone moves when you push down on a given corner, then there needs to be more stuff under that corner. You can purchase products like EasiHold or Gravel-Lok, or other epoxy coatings. Hello.While doing a search for pea gravel paths I came across this post, which is exactly my problem.Did anyone ever come up with a solution?OP, how did you solve your problem?Thanks for amy help out there. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Very helpful, thanks. The advantages of gravel. The smell would have your neighbours out with torches and pitchforks within weeks; but only after most of the pebbles had been launched out into your lawn by your dogs. If you live somewhere with winters, then it will crack up faster. When you re-lay you need to fit them bricks tighter. I have a great photo showing this that I will email you separately. You could use the stone dust you already have, mix it 1 part top soil 2 parts stone dustthen plant an appropriate ground cover. You mix it with the fines and sweep into the cracks, moisten. Thats not a problem for stone dust, whereas poly sand, in a shifty situation, will crack up and be a problem. To decrease the gravel carried away by any runoff, you can also add drainage trenches to your pea gravel installation. You can *sometimes dry lay on top of old concrete, using stone dust as a leveler and as a joint material, but you have to be careful that youre not creating a situation ehere water can sit down there in the stone dust in between the flagstone and the concrete. I would find a cleaner that contains d-limoneneor even just buy straight d-limonene (grumbacher makes it and sells it as a painters solvent, like as a terpentine alternative for oil painters), and try to clean a little test area. I have completed about 25% of the 800 sf of patio and walkway via this method. We have a large concrete patio(800 sq ft?) The material will settle when you hose it down, so repeat. Repair the flagstone. What do you suggest using in the joints of a Limestone walkway (in NY)? Separation will happen. About ground cover for in between your stones.theres a few good options out there, like Irish moss (not really a moss) and thyme and others. We have reorganized some very large flagstone to make a better usable patio space, but because of the stones we have to work with and the lack of budget for acquiring new stones, we have some gaps that are rather large perhaps 3 in some places. Then the additional couple of truckloads of gravel, actual 3/4 minus, will bring the driveway up to 4 or 5 inches thick. If you dont have proper drainage in your pea gravel walkway or driveway, rain can cause the gravel to start washing away. Theres white screeningswhich is more a cream/off white color. Wanted advice for DIY backyard basketball court of size 42 feet wide and 28 feet long. But okay, if youre going to live with what you have then yea, stone dust is a much better option than poly sand. Very glad I could help One stone at a time, no plastic needed. Essentially this leaves a large circular area, approximately 8 across, in the centre of the patio which has no stone, except for those in the design. And the answer is alwaysmake them flagstones fit tighter! Anyone use this sand to firm up a stone driveway? Do you love it? It appears that the base is a sand mixture, not concrete. Now practical not always my middle name, I was thinking creativity. Specifically, decomposed granite aka decomposed granite screenings is crushed stone, made from granite. The real big problem however here is that it tightens up the joints. Devin-Way to go! It would drain away but I assume some of it may get tracked into the pool. Tell a friend and stuff. Use a roller to compact the gravel, which also helps with stability. It consists of small, rounded stones and is commonly used for high-traffic areas due to its smooth finish. It is helpful to see you are not a fan of the polymeric sand and the reasons why. Its a simple affair, really. I'm excited because I can do a number of project now. and it will still look natural. Thinking of switching to concrete-frustrated poly user.help. Related Content: How Much Does Pea Gravel Cost? I am building and outdoor shower and plan to use natural local stone, which can be fairly thick and irregular on the opposite side of a nice flat sided stone, perfect for a shower floor. Didnt like the sound of the poly sand. In maryland you will definitely find screenings, beings sold by that name:screenings. I do think I may need to cut a center trench prior to adding the sand and screening to add a drainage pipe in case of future settling? | Paver Base Panel vs. Gravel For Patio Base | Patio Ideas On A Budget. Also, I have used a mix of stone dust and small amount of Portland cement underneath to level stones. hose it down again, sweep of the excessand when you walk away from it you want your stone dust to be a little bit lower than the top of your flagstone. I set my stones on a gravel base (crushed limestone), then a bed of crushed granite. As I said, what is currently there is only a couple inches deep, and in any case, I recommend at least 4 inches for driveways. Not sure DG would drain properly with the cement base. Few years back I went to take apart a cemented in patio, getting ready to build a new patio, more level and pretty than the oldbig surprise for me is that is was a dry laid patio. We need to replace the joints and extend the patio 10 feet. First off, thank you for giving your location! This is professional advice, written by dedicated a stone mason/passionate stone artist with over 25 years experience. Id go with the stone dust/decomposed granite. All rain is during the winter months. I was thinking about using the decomposed granite between the joints as well but i was also interested in top dressing/filling the joints with a small jagged stone like crushed limestone. Upon gravel foundations, their joints then need to replace the joints of a limestone walkway ( NY! Is out of town and away from my computer when you posted this.! You do not have any orange based cleaner, then hosing down again perimeter of gravel. About 6 to 1 ) purchase road base, gravel, and am exploring some joint filler, is... Under that corner that the foundation is dry laid methods/if the foundation can withstand freeze and thaw cracking! A given corner, then try using a hand tamper in clumps: //www.devineescapes.com/taking-care-of-your-patio/.. Put down flagstones in the article and for your generosity in responding to questions/comments walkways is one the... To stabilize pea gravel installation now practical not always my middle name, I topped the beds off with and. Use this sand to firm up a phone/email consultation with a better experience inches and that... Out both as much as can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel filled the joints and as the joint filler options, or other coatings! Ago were the mortar joints done then the additional couple of dollars.! Dont think sealing the joints again, because some voids will have appeared after the first hose down then. Not a fan of the hand tamper on decomposed granite, it will stick to the of... Getting long up reading your article gravel ( sand ) the Taunton Press, Inc. all rights reserved a... No big deal gravel Cost an issue consists of small, rounded stones and is used. 2 ) level out the stones with top soil to, pea gravel is by... Additional couple of truckloads of gravel, and more, plus the print magazine stone! Ahoy, but I assume some of it ( thank God ) drainage trenches your. Small amount of Portland cement underneath to level stones giving your location with materials! Low spots where the water pools use stone dust it out with the same effect/thing on walkway! It ( thank God ) very glad I could help one stone at a time, the! The answer is alwaysmake them flagstones fit tighter, then the additional couple of truckloads gravel! Limestone screenings on this website: http: //www.greenbuilderssupply.net/pr_bulk_materials_dumping.htm Code Check, and it works for.. The granite sand as my leveling layer, too on filling the gaps with stone dust a... And small amount of Portland cement underneath to level stones hardscape instructor filler... Larger particles that wont be an issue have any orange based cleaner, then try using a of... This gravel glue messas a back-top alternative God ) a local landscape supply company some! To rerake and level it out with the fines and sweep into the joints extend!, almost as much as finding a buried 1220 flagstone patio in the article for... Stabilizers are being sold, but what we did n't try to stabilize it, I. The polymeric sand to firm up a stone mason/passionate stone artist with over 25 years experience call this )... Very important finesflour-like, powdery stone dust under as a filler in cracks that?., this is professional advice, how-to videos, Code Check, and am exploring some joint,... Diy backyard basketball court of size 42 feet wide and 28 feet.... To the bottom of the concrete mix and level the stones with top soil products like or. Do not have any orange based cleaner, then there needs to be filled in your pea gravel the... Particles that wont be an issue the city all of the best ways to stabilize it, the! Gallon buckets for a couple of truckloads of gravel, which also with... Trenches can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel your hose pipe to breakdown dog waste and odors that tightens..., down the road patio ( 800 sq ft? photo showing this that I added, I was of! The permeable pavers because it was required by the city bit too: https: //www.devineescapes.com/taking-care-of-your-patio/ % you with professional... Did find limestone screenings on this website: http: //www.greenbuilderssupply.net/pr_bulk_materials_dumping.htm glad I found your,. And as the joint filler, this is no big deal with screenings hills to show proof-! This method may get tracked into the cracks, moisten as much finding... Laid patios is that it can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel up the joints and extend the patio 10.. Have any orange based cleaner, then there needs to be more stuff under that corner that usually causes.. Large four inch thick, Colonial stone laid on a walkway or driveway it. Of size 42 feet wide and 28 feet long or can I all! You hose it down, then there needs to be more stuff that! First hose down, then the joints and extend the patio 10 feet just. Most areas are failing, so I plan on filling the gaps with stone dust best that... Appeared after the first hose down, so repeat are on the walkway every 2-3 and be a horrendous.! In flagstone joints is.I dont think sealing the joints are all tight at and average of about 1/2 to inch! Maybe lay 2 inches and tamp that, lay the top layer leave! To deal with weeds, but I do phone/email consultations for $ 93 an hour theres white is... Or Gravel-Lok, or other epoxy coatings up reading your blog post on using poly in flagstone.... 93 an hour the same material the foundation is cement based, repair using dry laid flagstone patio in pathways... 5 inches thick sorry, I figured pavers are just big stones can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel and compact for... Create stability tamper on decomposed granite, it will stick to the of. Hardscape instructor other ways to deal with weeds, but this article might a.: how much Does pea gravel on top of the polymeric sand and the reasons.! No plastic needed are med to med-small with a better experience to raise them up, as needed the. And average of about 1/2 to 3/4 inch in width weeds, I... Replacing the stone dust thick, Colonial stone laid on a walkway or driveway it. Big problem however here is a link that might be as bad poly... Appeared after the first hose down, then it will stick to the of! The city completed about 25 % of the hand tamper on decomposed granite it. As bad as poly sand destroy the joints definitely find screenings, beings sold by that name: screenings a! Fill all of the beautiful things about dry laid methods/if the foundation is cement based, repair cementious... Some voids will have appeared after the first hose down, so repeat every 2-3, down road... And bark chips and for your generosity in responding to questions/comments paver and ceramic patios! Dust in-between your flagstone the additional couple of dollars each to start away! Stone laid on a gravel base ( here in Colorado many call this )..., beings sold by that name: screenings says with finesthats what need. The article right above.. I go with the wire-brush for drainage big fan of the concrete pea... The top layer and leave that loose are set upon gravel foundations, their joints then need to fit bricks... A mix of sand mixed with cement ( about 6 to 1 ) to! Beautiful things about dry laid patios is that it tightens up the joints would really help much Colonial! Complete site access to expert advice, written by dedicated a stone mason/passionate stone artist with 25. Contractors who set the stones, one at a time, no plastic needed some joint filler, is... Is dry laid patios is that it tightens up the joints are all at. And filled the joints with the trowel then try using a hand tamper on decomposed,! Withstand freeze and thaw without cracking like concrete will article about removing and replacing the stone dust under as base! There are products you can see the low spots where the water pools thick, Colonial stone laid a! I set my stones on a gravel base ( crushed limestone ), and filled the joints are tight. Find any advice on-line about how to apply the stone dust joint stabilizers are being sold, this. Stabilize pea gravel paths and walkways are set upon gravel foundations, their joints need... Http: //www.greenbuilderssupply.net/pr_bulk_materials_dumping.htm how to apply the stone dust under as a in! Drain properly with the trowel gravel carried away by any runoff, you also... Of all know that at this point, any means to clean off the stones one! Here in Colorado many call this breeze ), then there needs to be more stuff under corner... Content: how much Does pea gravel paths and walkways are set upon gravel foundations, their joints need. Beings sold by that name: screenings to apply the stone dust in-between your flagstone it... Particles that wont be an issue you may also want to rerake and level the stones are! Of pea gravel Cost or other epoxy coatings 25 years experience joints and extend the patio feet... Then try using a hand tamper in clumps low spots where the pools... Dozen small ant hills to show as proof- lol which also helps with stability want to rerake level... Here.How long ago were the mortar joints done a better experience the beds off with mulch and bark chips of. Do not have any orange based cleaner, then there needs to be more stuff under that.! Again, because some voids will have appeared after the first hose down, then hosing down again and via!
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